Tracing Carabinieri units in Africa Settentrionale - Help.

[James]

Good afternoon to all,

Our family are trying to pinpoint where exactly our Uncle fought during WW2. We have already received his Ruolo Matricolare, and after a year of constant research (including the services of a professional researcher here in Italy) it appears that our Uncle’s Foglio Matricolare and Scheda di Prigionia have either been lost, or destroyed. There is no “official” record of him serving overseas, however we have photos of him in North Africa as well as several letters he wrote whilst a Prisoner-Of-War in Algeria.

At the time of his imprisonment (letters are all dated from 1944) he held the rank of Vice-Brigadiere with the Carabinieri Reali. Photos of him in North Africa show him in the early war grey-green woolen uniform (rather than the lighter tropical version) and one photo of him heavily bandaged with numerous abrasions/scrapes appear to indicate that he was wounded in action. Strangely, other photos of him in North Africa show him in a civilian suit in the company of uniformed Italian military personnel (in tropical uniform) and a priest. It appears he was in Casablanca, Morocco a few months after the armistice in 1943, and by September of 1944 was in a POW camp (NATOUSA Prisoner of War Enclosure 178) located in Oran, Algeria.

I have already spoken with the National Historical Museum of the Carabinieri here in Italy, as well as numerous archives yet no one appears able to determine exactly which Carabinieri units were present in Africa Settentrionale.

Perhaps a long shot, but might any of our fellow members be aware of any quality books or other publications on the subject of Italy in A.S? Utilising the Italian Order of Battle as at 1943 doesn’t help, but unfortunately neither does our meager single page of our Uncle’s Ruolo Matricolare.

Kindest regards to all.

 

[diciassette2000]

Establishing which units belonging to the Carabinieri of the Royal Army fought in North Africa and Tunisia is not extremely difficult, it is difficult to do it in total without knowing in which period of the campaign Your uncle was taken prisoner. To understand well, one should know at least in brief which period to consider and if he served in the metropolitan or colonial carabinieri. At least try to set a rough time and then let me know.
All the best
Maurizio

 

[James]

Good morning Maurizio,

Thank you for your response.

Unfortunately we don’t have many exact dates. On the 21 June 1939 our Uncle was posted to Genova, where he resided upon his eventual posting to North Africa. We do know that he was present in Casablanca, Morocco during the 29-30-31 of October 1943. Our Uncle then writes a letter from his POW camp in Oran, Algeria on the 7 September 1944. From the few photos we have it does not appear he was a part of the Carabinieri Coloniali, because he is not shown wearing the colonial uniform. He is wearing the grigio-verde uniform with the standard infantry equipment, although with the collar tabs and badge of the Carabinieri. A single, brief annotation on his Ruolo Matricolare appears to show the date 10/1/43 on top of C.C.R.R., with a large cross written over the top. I wonder if this is supposed to intend his date of capture? Unfortunately this document is poorly written and was never updated to reflect his war service, so we don’t have any other dates to offer.

Kindest regards,

James

 

[diciassette2000]

the capture date was January 1943, the search would become much shorter because it would mean that the capture dates back to the Tunisian campaign therefore he would have been possibly in force with a unit belonging to the 30th Army Corps who fought in Tunisia with the 5th German army or with the 1st Italian army of General Messe. It would be interesting to be able to know at least that, otherwise it gets complicated ......
all the best
Maurizio

 

[James]

Ciao Maurizio,

Apologies for my tardy reply - with our global situation this forum was the last thing on my mind. Now, with our quarantine situation, it appears that continuing with my research is the best option.

As I posted earlier, without the complete Foglio Matricolare or Scheda di Prigionia, I suppose it’s almost impossible to decipher my Uncle’s Carabinieri Unit.

If I assume his date of capture was the 10/01/1943, would this help in tracing all of the Carabinieri units present in Tunisia at that time?

I have invested in many good quality books (both in Italian and English) regarding the North African campaign and the Carabinieri, however I am simply unable to work out which units served where, and when. Even amongst the Italian sources, there is so much conflicting and confusing (even incomplete) information. It appears that the Carabinieri have been almost forgotten, aside from the famous Carabinieri Paracadutisti.

I would appreciate any information you may have, and if you prefer, I can privately message you in Italian.

I hope you and your family are OK with our current terrible situation in our beloved Italia.

Kindest regards,

James

 

[diciassette2000]

We are now all in strict quarantine, only one person can go shopping or in the pharmacy, all the others can only turn one at a time 200 meters from home. The deaths are about 800 per day, half of which in Lombardy alone, hospitals are collapsing especially in the north, cemeteries and crematoriums are unable to keep up. Funerals are not allowed and people die on their own sometimes even at home. The army carries corpses out of the region to uncrowded cemeteries or crematoria with military trucks. There are no more medical devices, masks and disinfectants. The situation is worsened by the usual Italian bureaucracy. Do you think that to buy masks and medical equipment in this situation the government uses the usual bankruptcy procedure with biblical times while people continue to die .... however for your problem if the war theater is the Tunisian one I will try to send you an exhaustive list of all the carabinieri units present at December-January 1943. The language problem does not exist I can write well enough in English ... I will send it to you on this forum ..... I hope within today
All the best
Maurizio

 

[James]

I flew out of Italy in February just before the situation worsened - I was scheduled to return last week, but of course that didn’t happen. Unfortunately I don’t think we will be able to move for quite some time. I can only communicate with my family via the phone, but at least they’ve no major problems - yet. They have explained the quarantine situation. Only in recent days have I now started hearing of the deaths of family friends in our valley; it appears that no matter how remote you may live, this horrible virus is able to reach you. One thing that has caused me displeasure is the total apathy of the people in the country where I am at present - absolute madness and panic to empty the supermarkets of food, toiletries and medical supplies, yet this country is virtually untouched by the virus in comparison to Italy. Many people here complain, incapable nor willing to understand the disastrous situation in other countries, in our particular case, Italy. Without continuing in vain, I can only wonder what our Nonni and Bisnonni would think of this situation. I’ve always wanted to believe that they fought (and died) to improve our future (without mentioning the politics of every conflict). It saddens me to think of what they might have to say about our world today.

Alas, to our previous point: I think I am slowly deciphering the story of our Uncle. IF the date on his Ruolo Matricolare IS in fact the date of capture, then I can only surmise he was in one of two places; Libia, between Tripoli and Bengasi; or Tunisia. I didn’t know that Italian forces were still fighting in Libia until the 23rd of January 1943.

I thank you again for your generous information and your time, especially in this difficult period.

Kindest regards,

James

 

[diciassette2000]

Here is the list of Royal CCRR units in Tunisia in December 1942-January 1943 which remained so until the end of the campaign. In Tunisia he fought both the 1st Italian army and the 30th Army Corps which was part of the 5th German armored army operating on the Tunis front. Unfortunately, as regards the 1st army, many diaries have been lost and on the issue of the carabinieri there is not much merit in the archives, both general and private. It is however a fairly exhaustive list even if vast enough to succeed without a precise reference in knowing the exact unit of reference . A note ....after 23 January 1943 no italian unit fought in Libia ...only in Tunisia....
All the best
Maurizio

PS
If you want any help tell me....


30.o Corpo d’Armata (30th Army Corps)
-CCRR (Carabinieri Reali)
--1.a sezione mista CCRR “Superga” (Divisione di fanteria Superga)
--2.a sezione mista CCRR “Superga” (Divisione di fanteria Superga)
--235.a sezione CCRR (30.o Corpo d’Armata)
--254.a sezione CCRR (30.o Corpo d’Armata)
--386.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (30.o Corpo d’Armata)
--275.a sezione mista CCRR (Intendenza Tunisia)
--276.a sezione mista CCRR (Intendenza Tunisia)
--672.a sezione CCRR (50.a brigata Speciale “Imperiali”)
--677.a sezione CCRR (50.a brigata Speciale “Imperiali”)
--28.o battaglione CCRR

1.a Armata (1st Army)
-CCRR (Carabinieri Reali)
--18.o battaglione CCRR (1.a armata)
--105.a sezione CCRR (Divisione corazzata GGFF)
--22.a sezione CCRR (divisione AS42 Trieste)
--23.a sezione CCRR (divisione AS42 Trieste)
--76.a sezione CCRR (divisione AS42 Pistoia)
--80.a sezione CCRR (divisione AS42 La Spezia)
--115.a sezione CCRR (divisione AS42 La Spezia)
--106.a sezione CCRR (divisione corazzata Centauro)
--266.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--620.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--621.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--660.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--671.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--675.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--676.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--677.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--680.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--681.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)
--704.a sezione motorizzata CCRR (1.a armata)