Weird M11/39 markings

[Kustosz2137]

Hi! Some time ago I've found this photo of M11/39. As you can see, there is marking of 2nd tank of 4th platoon. This made me wonder - which unit has companies made of 4 platoons?

When trying to do my own research in the internet I've also found another weird photo, this time showing number 7 above company and platoon marking. Is it possible that some units had platoons made of 7 (or more) tanks?

Thanks for any kind of help!

 

[Hardrada55]

24 M11/39 tanks in AOI. Two companies of 12 M11/39 tanks each. Each company has 4 platoons. Three tanks per platoon.

 

[Kustosz2137]

24 M11/39 tanks in AOI. Two companies of 12 M11/39 tanks each. Each company has 4 platoons. Three tanks per platoon.

Thanks for help! Tho I'm still wondering what's going on with 2nd photo

 

[Kustosz2137]

24 M11/39 tanks in AOI. Two companies of 12 M11/39 tanks each. Each company has 4 platoons. Three tanks per platoon.

Something is not right here... I've found another photo, and there is 4th tank of 4th platoon...

 

[diciassette2000]

The typical formation of the M11 battalions was foreseen on the command company with 4 tanks and two companies with 16 tanks each (4 platoons of 4 tanks each) for a total of 36 M11 / 39 tanks. in the case of the two units equipped with M11 / 39 tanks sent by the 32nd regiment in AOI, however, there was a variation. On 24 April 1940 a company strong of 24 M 11/39, and largely formed by volunteer tankers, was sent by the 1st M tank battalion of VERONA to East Africa. When it arrived, the Higher Command split it into two companies on three tank platoons each in turn of 4 chariots which were named respectively 321.a, and 322.a destined for ADDIS ABABA. The first two digits of the distinctive number of the two companies remembered the regiment of origin while the companies of the battalion of origin remained the same, that is, the 321st company had the 1st, 2nd and 3rd platoon while the 322th had the 4th, 5th and 6th platoon.
All the best
Maurizio

 

[jwsleser]

Thanks Maurizio

I was writing a response when you posted your answer. Your response is a much explanation than mine.

Pista! Jeff

 

[diciassette2000]

However, I still have considerable doubt that is determined by this situation. If the third photo was actually taken in Agordat, I understand that the wagons belonged to the 321.a company that participated in the fight of MONTE KOBEN at CASSALA on 31 January 1941 and was then destroyed at AGORDAT towards the end of the following month of March. If the wagon (or wagons) belonged to the 4th platoon they had to be from the 322th company ....... well ..... terrible doubt ....... the Italians .... the usual .... incomprehensible warriors..
All the best
maurizio

 

[Kustosz2137]

The typical formation of the M11 battalions was foreseen on the command company with 4 tanks and two companies with 16 tanks each (4 platoons of 4 tanks each) for a total of 36 M11 / 39 tanks. in the case of the two units equipped with M11 / 39 tanks sent by the 32nd regiment in AOI, however, there was a variation. On 24 April 1940 a company strong of 24 M 11/39, and largely formed by volunteer tankers, was sent by the 1st M tank battalion of VERONA to East Africa. When it arrived, the Higher Command split it into two companies on three tank platoons each in turn of 4 chariots which were named respectively 321.a, and 322.a destined for ADDIS ABABA. The first two digits of the distinctive number of the two companies remembered the regiment of origin while the companies of the battalion of origin remained the same, that is, the 321st company had the 1st, 2nd and 3rd platoon while the 322th had the 4th, 5th and 6th platoon.
All the best
Maurizio

Thank you very much! One last question tho: 4 tanks from command unit were 2x company commanders + commamder and his assistant, or battalion commander and 3x assistants?

 

[diciassette2000]

One for commander, three for "reserve detachment".....
Keep in mind that that configuration was actually assumed by only 2 battalions of M11 / 39 deployed by the Italians in AS while as I told you in the previous post the only other M11 deployed in AOI considered a different organic configuration. The "fix" of the Italians to always keep a detachment of replacement vehicles was dictated by the almost certainty that some means would surely have mechanical problems before entering the line given the fragility of the Italian tanks of the time together with the characteristics of the war theaters to be faced ....
All the best
Maurizio

 

[Kustosz2137]

Some time later, but I finally know what's going on with 2nd photo; there was a flaw on a photo and real number is just 2

 

[Kustosz2137]

However, I still have considerable doubt that is determined by this situation. If the third photo was actually taken in Agordat, I understand that the wagons belonged to the 321.a company that participated in the fight of MONTE KOBEN at CASSALA on 31 January 1941 and was then destroyed at AGORDAT towards the end of the following month of March. If the wagon (or wagons) belonged to the 4th platoon they had to be from the 322th company ....... well ..... terrible doubt ....... the Italians .... the usual .... incomprehensible warriors..
All the best
maurizio

Platoon marking works in different way; 4 stripes mean that it's 4th platoon in this particular company, not the platoon numbered 4.
For example: you have 6 platoons overall numbered from 1 to 6 respectively.
You split them among 2 companies, 1, 2 and 3 to 1st one and 4, 5 and 6 to 2nd.
Then platoon numbered 1 will be first platoon in 1st company, so it's marking will be single stripe on red rectangle.
Platoon numbered 4 on the other hand will be 1st platoon in 2nd company, so it's marking will be single stripe on blue rectangle etc.

I highly doubt that this photo was taken in Agordat, but for different reason;
On this photo we can see 4th tank of the 4th platoon, so it means that this company had to have at least 16 tanks (4 platoons, 4 tanks each), but as we know companies in East Africa were made of 12 tanks. On the other hand this marking could be made before splitting company in two and just wasn't repainted after.

 

[Kustosz2137]

The typical formation of the M11 battalions was foreseen on the command company with 4 tanks and two companies with 16 tanks each (4 platoons of 4 tanks each) for a total of 36 M11 / 39 tanks.

Recently I got curious again. Where did this info come from?

The described structure cannot be true, as we know, that M11/39 battalions had distinct company commanders, just like any other unit. One such commander was well known Giuseppe Locatelli (1 cp. I Btg.).
In addition there are no available photos of M11/39 in AS with more than 3 platoon stripes.