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Compagnia presidiaria - designations and units of assignment.

jwsleser

Member
Staff member
I have learned about units called compagnia presidiaria. These are companies that are part of each regiment and are used for requirements behind the lines of the regiment. Examples are garrison duties, movement control, security, etc. The companies are formed using soldiers not fit for front line service. These can include soldiers recovering from wounds, not meeting physical standards, have family situations (only son, eldest, etc.) or other considerations. These companies are part of the regiment.

The challenge is that their numbering/identification doesn't correspond to the regiment to which they belong. The following is from COMPAGNIE PRESIDIARIE

This is demonstrated, among many others, by the precise reconstruction of the organization and tasks of the so-called Presidiaria Companies, completely unknown (alas) to those who write before reading Prof. Preziosi's book. Incidentally, the Presidiaria Companies, made up of personnel not employed on the front, had, as the name suggests, support and control functions (movement controls, depots, etc.). Each regiment had one or more Presidiaria Companies, numbered differently from the regimental organization. The indicative number of the Company was followed by a letter of the alphabet according to the number of Presidiaria Companies which the Regiment had at its disposal. For example: 78th Presidiaria Company (a - b because they were two) of the 29th Infantry Regiment of the "Pisa" Brigade.
[my translation].

I have found several other website that state basically the same thing. These units were common in the latter part of the 1GM, with several earning awards.

I am specifically looking for the 47ª cp. presidaria that was in Albania in 40-41. I realize this is a wish, but is there any source that identifies these units and their parent regiments in the 2GM?

Grazie!
 

jwsleser

Member
Staff member
This is from Compagnie Presidiarie

Again on the garrison companies

The garrison companies were made up of soldiers, including officers, not entirely suitable for "war efforts", sick people who were not fully recovered or subject to relapses, lightly wounded, who had passed the age for the territorial militia during the war years, mobilized already belonging to the Category II, married with numerous offspring, perhaps even widowers, etc. and they were intended, in fact, for the defense of the territory behind the first and second lines or for coastal defense on the Adriatic in a theater of war. They served to support the numerous needs of a large army engaged in weapons: stage commands, quartermasters, writers/secretaries, warehouse workers, cooks, bakers etc. but also as military police together with the carabinieri and they depended in any case on the regiment for which they served as a transit depot [unit] for the military going to the front or returning. Each regiment had one or more garrison companies in the rear, marked by a number, followed by a small distinctive letter, however [the number] different from that of the regiment itself. For example only, a comparison between the company number and the regiment number for some of these [units] are provided. 78ª (2 companies) for the 29th infantry; 79ª (7) for the 10th infantry; 80ª (8) for the 9th infantry; 81ª (6) for the 48th infantry; 82ª (4) for the 47th infantry; 83ª (2) for the 20th infantry; 84ª (3) for the 19th infantry; 85ª (5) for the 86th infantry; 86ª (3) for the 85th infantry; 87ª (3) for the 6th infantry; 8ª (2) for the 5th infantry; 89ª (7) for the 3rd infantry; 90ª (4) for the 4th infantry; 91ª (3) for the 76th infantry; 92ª (2) for the 75th infantry; 93ª (6) for the 46th infantry; 94ª (4) for the 45th infantry; 95ª (4) for the 1st grenadiers; 113ª (?) For the 3rd alpini. It goes without saying that in peacetime there was only one presidiaria company at the depot of each regiment. After the rout at Caporetto, more than one of them constituted the last bulwark on the banks of the Tagliamento and Piave at the advance of the Austrians. They almost always behaved heroically by taking numerous losses by stopping the enemy.
[my translation]
 
Hi Jeff
I have not understood if you want news about the garrison companies of the 1st world war or those of the second. However, the base was always the same were small units armed only with light weapons formed by third and fourth line personnel or convalescent or disabled in the first line service. They were intended "for the garrison" therefore they served as static guards at sensitive military and civilian posts. In the 2nd World War they had no homogeneous mobilization nor "logical" that is, how territorial or coastal or presidential battalions could be mobilized either by infantry regiments or by cavalry regiments as well as by Alpine or bersaglieri regiments. They did not have a numerical logic therefore they were numbered in series from 1 year with also number jumps especially for those mobilized in late 1942. As well as the German Landesschutzen battalions (later Sicherung) more companies could be framed in a presidential battalion which in fact represented the only command as well as several territorial or coastal battalions could be framed in a coastal or territorial regiment without a fixed criterion. In the Second World War there were at least 200 if not more therefore following its fate in detail is a difficult undertaking .....
All the best
Maurizio
 

jwsleser

Member
Staff member
Buongiorno Maurizio

I have not understood if you want news about the garrison companies of the 1st world war or those of the second.
I was specifically looking for the regiment at the 47ª cp. presidiaria was assigned to while in Albania in 1940-41.

Overall, I was hoping there was a source that listed all the cp. presidiario in the 2GM. I understand that this is likely fantasy, but one can ask. :D

In the 2nd World War they had no homogeneous mobilization nor "logical" that is, how territorial or coastal or presidential battalions could be mobilized either by infantry regiments or by cavalry regiments as well as by Alpine or bersaglieri regiments. They did not have a numerical logic therefore they were numbered in series from 1 year with also number jumps especially for those mobilized in late 1942. As well as the German Landesschutzen battalions (later Sicherung) more companies could be framed in a presidential battalion which in fact represented the only command as well as several territorial or coastal battalions could be framed in a coastal or territorial regiment without a fixed criterion. In the Second World War there were at least 200 if not more therefore following its fate in detail is a difficult undertaking .....
Yes. I realize that this is likely the case. Like the btg. territoriali mobili, it will be difficult to know all the units and where they were assigned.

I had not previously read about the cp. presidiaria. I always assumed the the btg complementi or the btg. marche did these tasks.

I provided the links so everyone will know my sources about the cp. presidiaria. AS these units were first created in 1GM, the links naturally talk about that timeframe. The units were the same in the 2GM.
 
It is not quite correct that the units mobilized in the 1st World War by the Royal Army were the same and with the same criteria as those mobilized in the second. An example are the territorial battalions which after 1942 became coastal which in the 1st World War were mobilized in a completely different way from that of the Second World War ... another example are the Alpine companies and in a certain sense also the presidential battalions ... however the 47th presidential company was actually in Albania and stayed there for the duration of the war. Unfortunately I cannot be precise on the unit of origin which, as I have already said, can be varied ... in general, the subsidiary companies stationed in areas occupied before 1940 by the Italians came from units originating from the deposits of the units already present before 1940 therefore I would be inclined to tighten the search on the deposits of the 5 large units present in Albania before 1940 .... but however it is only a hypothesis ..... I will try to see if I can learn more even if as I said it won't be an easy search ....
All the best
Maurizio
 
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